#260 - STOP PLAYING SMALL, AND EVOLVE, with Sarah Pirie-Nally


Welcome to another episode of the 'Your Dream Life' podcast!

Today, I am thrilled to have a conversation with one of my closest friends and a truly inspiring entrepreneur, Sarah Pirie-Nally.

Sarah is a visionary entrepreneur and a business leader who has made significant strides in various industries, including financial services, travel, tourism, utilities, and education.

She has a knack for identifying opportunities and driving results with her strategic thinking and collaborative approach.

Currently, she is focused on her venture, Wonder and Wander, where she leverages her skills to drive success while advocating for neurodiversity and solving complex problems.

In this episode, Sarah and I discuss:

  1. The transformative power of retreats and how they can open up new perspectives and opportunities.
  2. The importance of following your inner desires and making intentional choices in life.
  3. The concept of 'time abundance' and practical tools for balancing a busy life while pursuing your dreams.
  4. Insights into her upcoming retreat, She Evolves, in Byron Bay, and why it’s a must-attend event for women seeking growth and transformation.

Sarah’s journey is a testament to the power of dreaming big and taking actionable steps toward your goals.

Whether you're looking to reinvent yourself or simply need a boost of inspiration, this episode is packed with valuable insights that you can immediately apply to your own life.

Join us for this engaging conversation and discover how you too can create a life you love.

As always, I’d LOVE to hear what resonates with you from this episode and what you plan to implement after listening in. So please share and let’s keep the conversation going in the Dream Life Podcast Facebook Group here.    

Have a wonderful weekend… and remember, it all starts with a dream 💛

Enjoy! 💛

Dream Life Founder 


  • She Evolves Retreat (August, Byron Bay)
  • Learn more & register here for our FIJI REINVENT YOU RETREAT. Embark on a transformative journey guided by Kristina Karlsson, Sarah Pirie-Nally, Nicole Hatherly, and Shaynna Blaze.
  • Learn more & register here for our RECONNECT TO YOU Retreat.
    🌿 Experience the joy of a wonderful retreat, while learning how to run your own personal solo retreats 🌿 
  • Join my Platinum Coaching Program - where in June the focus is on going deep to help you plan the second half of the year for you. Learn more here.
  • Books Mentioned:
  • Join my virtual book club GROW for June where we'll meet weekly on Zoom to discuss and squeeze the learnings from this brilliant book, Build the Life You Want: The Art and Science of Getting Happier, by Arthur C Brooks & Oprah Winfrey. Learn more here…
  • Join my Habit Club and get support and accountability as you focus on changing the building blocks of your life - your daily habits. Learn more here…
  • Plan Your Year journal
  • Daily Progress Journal
  • Daily Wins Journal



Hi there and welcome back to another episode. I'm really excited about today because I have Another inspiring guest on the podcast, but I wanted to share something before I introduce her. As I was about to sit down and interview my guest, I really had a pinch me moment to sit down and interview one of my best friends to be inspired and laugh and call this work.

It's such an amazing feeling. And. I wanted to share that with you because that is what I want for you to [00:02:00] love what you get to do every day, to actually create and live your dream life. There's just nothing better. So let's get in to this inspiring episode. My guest, Sarah Perinale is a visionary entrepreneur and a business leader with passion for innovation and growth.

With extensive experience in building and scaling businesses, Sarah has established herself as an expert in in her field. Throughout her career, Sarah has demonstrated a unique ability to identify opportunities and drive results. Her expertise spans across various industries, including financial services, travel and tourism, utilities, and education.

She's known for her strategic thinking, collaborative approach. And dedication to excellence. Sarah's current focus is on wonder and wonder, and she evolves where she is leveraging [00:03:00] her skills and experience to drive success. She's also an advocate for neurodiversity designed to solve wicked problems and is committed to making a positive impact in her.

community. And she's also an incredible friend. And today we are going to talk about her upcoming retreat. She evolves, which is in Byron Bay in August this year, where I will be speaking, but I will also be attending. There are some incredible speakers and I just can't wait to attend as well as speak. I will link to that in the show notes.

If you want to join us, let's get right into it.

Hi, Sarah. I can't tell you how excited I am to have a conversation with my bestie on a podcast. So very warm. Welcome.

Sarah: Oh, this is, this is just like a warm chat, isn't it? But we're making it official.

Kristina: [00:04:00] We do. You know, I often think, and this is one of the reasons why I want to start my podcast because I've got these incredible conversation with people like you and lots of other people in our private book group and, you know, friends around the world.

And I always think, Gosh, imagine if we could just record these because there's often so much gold in them. So I'm so super, super grateful first to have you here. And also this will, this is what we call work. And I love that because it's like, can you really call this work? Like it's a conversation that's going to be so good.

So before we get started, I want to ask you a question that I ask Oh, my S and that is, did you have a dream as a kid, something you wanted to do or have or become?

Sarah: Oh, I had a million dreams as a kid. I wanted to be a ballerina and a lawyer, and I wanted to be an actress and I wanted to write books and I wanted to design games and I wanted to throw really cool parties and host dinner parties.

Yeah, I was a dreamer. [00:05:00]

Kristina: And you know what you still are and not just a dreamer, you're a doer as well. You make it, make your dreams happen, which is amazing. And you help other people like me make my dreams come true. So we'll talk about that in a second. We have listeners from all over the world. So I just want to, maybe for you to just give a little bit of a snapshot on your journey so far.

Sarah: Oh, okay. The rapid fire snapshot. So hello everyone around the world. I'm joining you from Melbourne, but I live between Melbourne and Auckland. I'm very lucky to be living my dream life. And it is very unconventional. And I think most people's true dreams are, if they're really honest. My experience has been through the business world.

I sort of started my career in corporate and loved kind of challenging paradigms and climbing the corporate ladder and ended up kind of finding my, I suppose, spicy why. By diving deeper into [00:06:00] innovation and opening minds and helping shape the culture of the Commonwealth Bank as a head of innovation, running a program called Wired for Wonder.

I left there and became an entrepreneur running various kinds of experiences all around innovation. So for me, I just love opening people's minds for transformational change. And I do that through events, retreats, experiences, and consulting. And every now and again, I'll jump back into a corporate job.

So I took a head of change role at NAB for a while. I took a chief design officer role at ASB. And I think normalizing that kind of, sometimes you can be entrepreneurial and sometimes you might want that safety of working in a bigger company was really important in my kind of career journey. But I'm also a mompreneur.

So I'm proudly juggling five beautiful children across the two countries. And You and I actually often talk about this, you know, we love our children so much and they're such an important part. So while we're like business boss babes who love like doing cool things, we also are so proud of these [00:07:00] small humans that we're raising.

And I think we both look for opportunities to expose them to the world and to make their dreams come true too. So I sort of think that mumpreneur word sometimes gets a dirty rap, but for me, that mum first before business lady is the bit that I kind of like to. Shine a bit of light on.

Kristina: Yeah, absolutely.

And I think also it's when you live your dream life, you need to make a room for all those different importance parts, you know, it doesn't really matter what comes first or second, but if you, if they're important to you, you need to make sure that you have room for both. And for me, that's been.

Combining work and family and you know, troubling the world while always working. It's so, you know, we, we reflected last year when we flew back to Sweden and normally we always stop on the way where we have, we used to have a shop and you know, Really amazing. Of course. I loved, loved that, but last year was really nice.

I actually stopped in Hong it was in Singapore and it was actually really nice to stop and not having to go [00:08:00] straight to an event because often it's like, you really have to, you know, it's, it sounds so amazing to fly around the world and it is. But it's also hard because it's tiring and, you know, the jet lags and the all that, that comes with that.

But that's all very, definitely a privilege. So today I want to talk about She Evolves because I have heard about your retreats for a very long time. And I. I was privileged to get asked as a speaker a couple of times, couldn't make it. And then because of that, we now do our video retreat together. But today I want to talk about She Evolves.

You know, there's always silver linings in the challenging time that you might have found me not being able to say yes and me not being able to do it. But you know, we now have made something incredible together. But today I want to talk about She Evolves because I think so many people listening to this podcast would love to be part of a retreat.

That is like She Evolves, because it's bigger than Fiji. We'll, we'll talk about the Fiji retreat and the difference between the two. But [00:09:00] I think She Evolves is for someone who might just want to find a new tribe and find someone who, someone who's looking for a kind of a new, new tribe and a new, new way of looking at things.

And I think I'd love for you to share that.

Sarah: Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, selfishly. I love retreats too. And I think all retreats need to be born with some sort of intention. And so my intention for She Evolves was to create a meeting place for women who really value self development, education, growth, spirituality, science, technology, change, design, travel, expansion.

You get the picture. It was like, The multifaceted woman who doesn't want to just be pigeonholed into like that one, you know, I'm a woman who, like, I'm a business woman, for example, or I'm an X or a Y, like I, I've actually tried really hard to not define myself too much and to just follow the energy and to have a good time.

Like you said before, like I'm not just a dreamer. I'm a [00:10:00] doer. I've got a pretty crazy portfolio of like ridiculous projects that I've brought to life. So She Evolves was about kind of thinking about how do I create a space to help women really tune into their heart's desires? So that they can bring to life, whatever their like true hearts desires are.

And, you know, that might be like writing a book or trying something new or asking for a promotion or retiring or doing an underwater shoot with a famous photographer. Like, it might be something. A bit weird, but the reason we call it, she evolves is the word evolve means to develop gradually. And so while like, this is definitely a transformation retreat, I sort of think, and I'm, I'm an experienced designer.

Like I've had a lot of experience designing learning and development programs, whether it was wide for wonderful com bank, which ran for 6 years and was like a. Not only a staff development experience, but also a community development experience. So [00:11:00] we created a conference that would help businesses, community, and our people all up level.

And so, you know, I've taken all the lessons there and kind of gone, how do I create a space that fits women of all ages and stages? And I think what's tricky is everyone for the first couple of years was like, yeah, but who's it for? And I'd be like, it's for women. And they're like, yeah, but what kind of woman?

And I'm like, It's for all women, you know, cause people just wanted to like, they shut down. But the magic of She Evolves is that it is an intergenerational community. So we have women who bring their daughters. We have women who bring their moms or their aunties or their sister. And they actually get an opportunity to hear from really inspiring speakers.

And thank you for coming and being one of my speakers this year. I'm so excited. And other really amazing speakers like Tarun Brumfitt, who was Australian of the year last year. Rhonda Swan, who's like an amazing PR kind of, you know, book publishing magnate who travels the world doing really [00:12:00] amazing thing with her wild women community.

We've got Lucy Bloom, who's just a phenomenal kind of innovation speaker, but she's just got so much to kind of offer. So, you know, we cover business, we cover life. We've got beautiful stories from Madeline West. Who is an actress and who has a lot to share Joe Smythe, who's actually written incredible book, which she got inspired to do through the She Evolves community.

And she'll be sharing that book with us. Another one of our community leaders. So, you know, there's this really group, amazing group of women. And I think I like to sort of think of the energies. that we want to create within this space. So if you're looking for a community of people who want to be like connected and brave and willing and open and curious and kind, but powerful and, you know, willing to take radical responsibility for themselves, committed to growth, no gossiping, no bitching.

This is that space. And I think what's [00:13:00] interesting about it is that that takes practice. And so I don't just call this a retreat, I do call it a practice because we've got so much coding that we're up against when we gather as women. And I think we've both had experiences where we've gone into a room and, you know, there's been a bit of bitching or a bit of side eye or a bit of gossip or a little bit of like, Not so great like energy at play.

And unfortunately that exists. And we just try to not let that exist within this space, which takes practice and a bit of consciousness.

Kristina: You know what I, I love for anyone who's listening and are thinking about joining this retreat or any retreat. I think the first one. It's just, you just, you just go in terms of don't overthink it because and I've got some experience on that.

I'll talk about that in a second with Antarctica, for example, but I remember this is a long time ago. I went on my first health retreat and I did that because I felt like I needed it and it was like very intentional. [00:14:00] But what I didn't understand when I booked that, that, that would set me up for life in terms of wanting to go back.

So one of my dreams is actually to go to a health retreat twice a year, because I feel like often it, once you go on a health retreat, then you come, come back and you start, you know, you implement everything you learned and continue what you, you did, but then after six months, there are some old patterns coming back in, and I think, and that's why I've been doing it twice a year, because It's not just about the health.

It's like, that's where I come up. So if it's a health retreat or she evolves or the Fiji retreat, retreats is a, it's an amazing place to meet like minded people and hearing speakers and all that. But I think the most important thing is that space that you have in between, because you hear from people and you meet people who are just different from you.

And often we, we, you know, we're hanging with like minded people and we want to do that, but. Expand. And when I met you, you know, we, we heard about each other for a long time. And and there [00:15:00] was a lot of people that knew us both. They're like, gosh, you guys will just get along so well. I was just like, Oh my God, why didn't we meet earlier?

But anyway, here we are. And I think for anyone who are thinking if If they haven't gone on a retreat, I think She Evolves is perfect because there is something for everyone that, you know, you use covering business, you're covering creativity, you're covering like, you know, Karen and, you know Tory with health.

And it's just so many like, so, so you're going to open up.

Sarah: It's not a sampler, isn't it? It's like getting to like experience all those different flavors. And then I've found people come to this and then they're like, Oh, I want to double down and do like a hardcore health retreat, you know, just health breath work, IVs, all the biohacking let's go.

Or they'll be like, Oh, I really enjoyed the business talk. So I'm going to go to a full business flavor. So I do feel like it's a bit of a degustation. Like you can just sort of try all the different flavors and kind of work out. What feels good for you. And one of the things I'm really [00:16:00] passionate about is making sure that when women come into the space, they have full permission to design the experience in a way that makes sense for them.

So if they get there and they're like, I'm tired, I need to sleep in. It's like cool, like wandering, like this isn't school. You're not going to get in trouble if you don't turn up to a session, you know, like come to the bits that feel good for you. Leave the bits that don't, this is the first year we'll record the talks so that then if you've missed stuff, you can kind of go back and like, eat it when you want to, which I'm so excited about because that then really plays to that radical flexibility, which I'm so, so passionate about providing within a space like this.


Kristina: Yeah, absolutely. And I think for someone who's never been on a retreat, I think this will open up to a whole new world that will never stop. And I think that's because I, you know, we did our first Fiji retreat together last year, and I've never done a retreat, and I only did it because I was in really good hands with you and the other two ladies, Nicole and [00:17:00] Shaina.

But it was so amazing because what we now are creating. So we're doing the Fiji retreat and we're also doing day retreat for those people who can't come to Fiji. And all the, the conversation that we have, and even like being part of each other's experiences, like she bonds and, you know, Shane, I just launched some music and, you know, I went to her Kind of launch night and just what it opens up.

So it's, it's not just about all you do at the retreat. It's what opens up from the retreat and all the incredible people that will, you know, give you so much for maybe a lifetime.

Sarah: It's true. And we, we cried happy tears when Shana told us that she was reducing, releasing her music album, because it felt like.

The best feeling in the world, watching another woman like be brave and follow her dreams. I got so much inspiration from that. And I, you know, I get so much inspiration from you as well. And I think we underestimate how powerful it can be to really lean into that feeling of uplifting each other [00:18:00] and being excited by each other's wins and saying, you know, instead of like being jealous, when you say someone who has something, what you want being like, Oh, they've got it.

Oh my goodness. That's so exciting.

Kristina: Learn from it and be inspired by it. And I actually invited someone to on my podcast and she replied saying, I think we, there's conflict of interest because I'm doing similar things to you. And I said, well, that, you know, that is true. We do similar things, but I think there's room for all of us.

And you know, so. And and I think, you know, obviously when everyone needs to work out what that is, because obviously when you start a new business and you don't want to give all the attention to your competitors, that's absolutely not what I'm saying, but you kind of established and you, you feel like, I feel like all of us are so similar, but we are so different.

And I think that's what makes the world so exciting. And I can just learn so much from so many people. And I think that's what makes, So exciting with especially at retreats because it's just endless. And, and I learned also [00:19:00] so much from the participants on our Fiji retreat. So, so that is another thing.

Like it's not just the speakers or the organizers. It's the people who are coming.

Sarah: Yeah, exactly. There's just a hundred reasons why they're such a lovely thing to do. And I think some people don't want to go to a retreat because they're worried about being caught in a room with people that they don't vibe with.

And I totally get that because I'm an ambivert and I know you're an introvert and you quite famously talk about how introverted you are. And you know, we design experiences, even our Fiji retreat or She Evolves are designed with the introvert ambivert extrovert in mind. And so there's, It's really carefully like guided, you know, parachute hooks that are like everywhere for you so that if you feel like you need to just go and have some you time that nobody's going to judge you.

And so creating that atmosphere, I think, creates like a bit of psychological safety for people to be able to come into an unknown environment, knowing that it's okay. They have permission to like. Leave if they [00:20:00] want to, no one's going to judge them. No one's going to be like, Oh, you didn't come to all the talks.

You know, what were you doing? All that sort of thing. And because of that, you create this actually relaxed atmosphere, which means you get so much more out of the experience.

Kristina: Yeah, absolutely. So if someone is listening right now and. Are thinking, Hmm, that sounds like me. Can you maybe just go through a little bit what it means, how many days, all that kind of stuff.

And then obviously link to it in the show notes. And if they can just go to your website straight away if they want to, but just talk a little bit about what they're. What kind of expectations they can have?

Sarah: Yeah. So the last two retreats for She Evolves were like a four night, five day. Our feedback from our participants was, Oh, I really want to come, but it's so hard to get away from work.

So we redesigned it this year to be a Thursday to Sunday. And so, It's a kind of like four day, three night experience. And if people want to, they can extend and stay the Sunday night. We're going to have a kind of extra add on luncheon, [00:21:00] like long luncheon on the Sunday. So people arrive Thursday to Byron Bay and we're staying at the beautiful elements, which is a five star eco lodge kind of resort in the middle of the hinterlands in Byron Bay, but it's also on a beach, which is so beautiful.

And like selecting the actual location is. So important to me. And I know you're the same when you're thinking about your day retreats or your solo retreats that you're hosting, because environment is everything. And so, you know, I've stayed at this place it's set in this like really idyllic kind of Astra Australian backdrop.

And, you know, it's just absolutely beautiful. So. People kind of come into Byron Bay Thursday night, we have our kind of first kickoff. And then we've got programming on Friday and Saturday with like a bit of a party. We've got a DJ coming on Saturday night, so we're going to have a bit of a dance. And then people kind of leave at their leisure on the Sunday or stay for that long lunch and extend that extra night.

If they're keen to do a little bit more kind of networking or integration, that sort of thing. And then in terms of the [00:22:00] programming, I like to design things in like an experience menu. So our speakers do like a 10 minute style Ted talk in the morning sessions. And everyone gets an opportunity to like hear from these amazingly inspiring people.

And then in the afternoons they choose their own adventure. And it can be a bit tricky cause you'll often want to go to two or three things, but you know, that kind of forces you into like making choices. And that's not a bad thing because it actually helps people really figure out like what bits are going to resonate for them.

And, you know, I mentioned before, like the whole point of this experience is to help women gain confidence, you know, in their choices, in their dreams and actually following the inner sparkle. And that's so hard to do in this current state world, because whether we're aware of it or not, we're being told, like, we should do this or we shouldn't do that, or women should be this way, or they shouldn't be that way.

And there's still the subconscious programming as well. So the program has been designed in a pretty playful way to get women Building gently that confidence to be like, actually, I, I want to go to that. And I'm going to like follow that in a sparkle, that [00:23:00] inner voice and actually follow my energy towards that.

And through that, you start to say women really taking bigger and bigger kind of courage leaps and risks and following their inner sparkle and. It's pretty cool. I love

Kristina: it. I love it. I

Sarah: love it.

Kristina: Oh, and also I should, we should mention that people can bring their children. So what do the kids do when they're not interested in some of the talks?

I'm assuming.

Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. So my, I've got five kids, as I mentioned before, some three beautiful step kids and two beautiful birth daughters. And my children actually wrote a business case as to why they need to go to She Evolves this year. And they said that. They get so much out of the speakers and they really enjoy meeting some of the other kids and they also enjoy getting their hair braided because we've typically done it in Fiji.

So I have had to track down and organize a hairdresser to come on site so that they can get their hair done if they would like to get their hair done and it's not all girl activities but we do have a lot of creative play set up and that's not just for the children that's also for [00:24:00] the adults. We organize a couple of.

Not child entertainers, but like nannies on site so that people can kind of drop in and out. But we design an environment that means that the kids have got opportunities to tune in and out as they kind of need to. And that's something I've played with, with all of the events that I've done over the last decade, whether that's like an on site crash or activities that are set up or, Just normalizing that kids are in the environment and that we can come and go and that like the kids can screech and make noise and play with cars.

And like, there's no sh or shaming your Children in the corner. Like, we absolutely need to practice making sure that Children feel safe there and that the mothers feel safe with their Children also. So again, that's a practice. It's about making sure that everyone there knows, you know, If one mom wants to come along and bring an iPad for their kid, like, there's no judging that, you know, we're all going to do what we're going to do to like, enjoy the experience and just do what works for us.

And actually, that is a really beautiful practice because within that we actually create this new way of being with each other [00:25:00] that's soft and that's nurturing and that's actually very feminine. So.

Kristina: Love that. Love that. And I'm bringing Tiffany. So I'm excited about that. So let's talk about Fiji. So I've never been to Chival's retreat.

So I'm super excited to be obviously speaking there, but I'm as excited, probably more excited to join it. So I just can't wait. And it's funny, because I was speaking at Forbes last week, and there was a lady there. And That I spoke to quite for quite a while. She was from the UK and we were talking. I said, Hey, I think you should come to she evolves because I felt like that's what she needed.

And then I met someone else and I was like, I think you should come to Fiji. And it's just something that, you know, I just feel like they're very different retreats. So do you want to talk a little bit about what you see? The difference is because obviously you've seen both.

Sarah: Oh, I have, and I've, and I've seen others as well because we, we host mastermind experiences.

We host strategy days. We host. [00:26:00] You know, innovation sprints, like I think depending on where someone's at, absolutely. There's a different kind of experience that's there for them. So a couple of key differences. We welcome men obviously to our reinvent you retreat in Fiji. That's probably like the most obvious difference is that she evolves as a, as a women's community.

And like, we welcome a few good men and some people bring their husband to help with children and all that sort of stuff. So, you know, there's a beautiful kind of inclusive nature to that, but largely it's about women coming together to practice. Being different with one another and be part of a women's retreat, whereas, you know, reinvent you, we're saying come along and I think the key difference for me would be if I'm going through a bit of like big change where I'm at a crossroad and I'm trying to figure out like I may have sold a business, I may be going through a bit of a retirement, but thinking about hitting refresh in my career.

I may have a successful business, but be wanting to hit refresh on that and, like, rethink or reimagine that, or I may be like a corporate leader who just knows I'm ready [00:27:00] to take that kind of next leap. So those kind of change junctions, they're the people that I steer to the Fiji retreat because I just think the reinvent you one we've spent quite a lot of time diving really deep into the learning journey and creating a really neat framework to take people through what is essentially a design thinking experience to help them, you know, dream.

Design, develop, and deliver to actually pull through change and to pull through, you know, a reinvention of their personal professional and purpose brand. So that's a really like sharp kind of more business y focused piece, I think, whereas the She Evolves one, you know, you actually may not be going through change.

You may just be wanting to like focus on your own development and learning a little bit more about yourself. And you know, there were women who've come along and learnt a little bit about someone else's spiritual practices and been like, Oh, I'm really curious about that. You know, talk to me about that.

I want to learn a little bit more about that or Someone who kind of shared something about technology and it was like, okay, [00:28:00] that's really interesting. I want to learn. So it's more of a learning based community versus that really targeted, like we're going to help scaffold you through and you're going to pull like thread a needle and like actually pull through a reinvention with the other ones.


Kristina: yeah. And as I said, I haven't been to She Evolves, but that's how I feel too, because I think also She Evolves is much, much more people. So you, you are able to then choose, What kind of group you want to kind of hang with versus I feel like with Fiji is smaller. So you kind of, we hang a little bit more all together.

So so I think that's a little bit of a difference as well. Plus that Fiji is a different kind of, it feels very different to Byron Bay. They're both spiritual in, in some ways, but very different. And, and obviously Fiji is a little bit quieter and yeah, it is. And also I felt like also some people were there to kind of completely reinvent themselves last year.

Like really. You know, really rethinking and also really thinking about their health because a lot of the women who were there were thinking about, you know, their next stage, which is [00:29:00] obviously really important in terms of health. So I felt like a lot of that reinvention and a lot of, like, really amazing outcomes for people.

Like, it's just been fascinating. We've

Sarah: loved seeing some of that, haven't we? We've seen podcasts, we're seeing books being written. We've definitely seen personal brands, like, In terms of just that sharpness, you know, there's something really lovely about when you meet someone and you know what they're about.

And, you know, I know personal branding is a really interesting topic that some people feel a bit uncomfortable about. I love it. I think personal branding is so powerful. Like you think about the brands that you just love and that you buy from, you do that because you trust them. You know what they're about.

You feel good when you use them, you know, whether that's a, yeah. Skincare product or a laundry detergent or, you know, a particular brand of oat milk, like those, whether you like it or not are a brand. And I think, you know, Nicole talks more about sort of branding humans humanely, but I've, I've had a big background in kind of understanding and designing brands.

[00:30:00] And really thinking about the neuroscience and empathy behind a brand. And so I think from a reinvention perspective, like what we love being able to do is hold that space for people to just discover and like dream and just really think about what's possible. And I just, I really have loved seeing the change that's come through that.

But I think the thing that's common about them is that. Retreats hold space for change. They just, whether you're going to Antarctica or Fiji or, you know, even if you're going on an online retreat, taking the time out of your normal schedule to work on yourself and to like, get curious and to think about, and you and I are so passionate about self development.

Like we both, I think we're both obsessed. That might be a really good word, but it's like, it's a little bit better. Like, I just want to always be a little bit better and learn a little bit more. And like, you know, dream a little bit bigger and like, you know, explore a little bit more. And I just find these gatherings, these intentional experiences [00:31:00] that you can be a part of.

are the perfect environment to do that. It's just fabulous. Yeah.

Kristina: Yeah. And you know, one thing that when we talk about personal brand, we, we all are a personal brand anyway, like you, you might not call it a brand, but we all have unique skillset, unique. Way of showcasing that or sharing that. And the way that Nicole does that is so amazing.

And the way you do it in the design and then me opening up for, you know, for me, that thinking a little bit bigger and then Shayna putting it all together in a, in a, in an amazing plan. And I'll have everyone of you in a couple of weeks. To get back together to really talk about Fiji specifically, but I think we all are a brand or we, you know, you can call it whatever you want, but basically we are unique and that's, what makes it so exciting as you can specialize yourself to be appealing to certain, you know, if it's organizations or starting a business or, you know, working for non for profit [00:32:00] or your passion project, it doesn't really matter, but I don't think we all are.

And, you know, Brad, call it what you like.

Sarah: Yeah. Nope. Totally agree. Totally agree. And the other part of it is, you know, as we've mentioned before, spending time with Other people who are doing cool things and who are, you know, exploring different concepts is so inspiring. And that just makes your life more enjoyable.

Like I'm so grateful that you're in my life because you just make my life so true. I will see your name pop up on my phone. I'll be like, Oh, Oh, I'm so excited to talk to you. You know, it's so nice. And you forget that, that It's part of it as well. Like, of course, business contacts are great and learning is great and expansion and all that sort of stuff is great.

But friendship is really beautiful, too. And it certainly shouldn't be discounted.

Kristina: And that's what I want to talk about next because I want to talk about our experience in Antarctica. I got so many questions and I feel like I haven't even, like, I just. You know, landed back and just end on with. So one of the things that I, it was really fascinating for me and [00:33:00] kind of an obvious one once you've been through it, but for someone who hasn't been to retreat.

So for example, Prue, who was part of our Fiji retreat, she then went to Antarctica with you. And I don't know, but I don't think that she had that in mind when she no, I

Sarah: don't

Kristina: think I

Sarah: don't know that it was on her bucket list.

Kristina: No. And then she went to Mexico and I just feel like, and you know, now she's speaking at she evolves and it's just so amazing how you can go to one thing, meet some people that really make you think a little bit different, or you look at them and think, I want what she's having.

And let's talk about Let's talk about Antarctica because so I had on my list, my 101 dream list, which is like 404 at least now. And so I wanted to go to Antarctica, but it wasn't really a urgent thing, like, I feel like that was a few things I wanted first. I wanted to go to South America, never been to South America.

So I actually ticked off two continents and I haven't I have a dream every year that is kind [00:34:00] of outside of my normal top three. And that is to. Visit a new country or a new city. And I don't make a decision in the beginning of the year where that's going to be. And it was funny cause I got, I got asked to speak in Korea and I've never been to Korea.

So I was like, yes, that's, that's ticking off, you know, I was going to go to Seoul and it was a country and a city, but that didn't, that didn't go ahead. So then I was like, Oh, something else will come up. Yeah. And so I ticked off the seventh continent and, and I ticked off South America and I ticked off Buenos Aires and which all are on my, on my list.

So let's talk about the amazing experience. Maybe you should start because it was just so incredible.

Sarah: It was so great. So I had the pleasure of hosting, yeah, you with another 152 incredible thought leaders stewards and guides. So my husband had partnered with insider expeditions to bring to life a concept [00:35:00] that we loved the idea of around stewardship.

And we basically invited people like Sir Edmund and Hillary's son, Peter Hillary, and. So Graham Henry, the All Blacks coach and Damon Gamow and Simon Bowen and a number of other really incredible kind of people that we respect and admire who think differently about our planet. And we wanted to see, like, basically if we brought people down to Antarctica, does that change your thinking about like the planet?

Do you care a little bit more? Do you care about climate change? Are you a little bit more aware? So we also partnered with the university of Tasmania and did a bit of a, an 18 month behavioral science project. One of my other feathers in my hat is that I'm a behavioral science practitioner. I've implemented behavioral science at scale within organizations.

That's a lot of fun. And so we wanted to kind of explore what was it like to bring people together on a different type of retreat. So this retreat was a nine night 11 [00:36:00] day experience from Ushuaia down to Antarctica. Called Stewardship, and it was pretty mind blowing, and we managed to convince you to come along with us.

And maybe you can share a couple of your experiences because I think a couple of things like this one was great because we managed to get so many different people to share ideas and thoughts and kind of inspiration across the experience, which was pretty inspiring.

Kristina: Oh, absolutely. And I, I want to start with how important it is to know what you want to do in life so you can make decisions.

Basically, you asked me, we were on another trip together and speaking on the entrepreneurship which was the Virgin Voyager. And on Friday night, I mean, and you mentioned it a few times during that trip, you should come, you should come. And I was like, yeah, yeah, one day I will, but not now. It was just not, it wasn't the right timing.

And I just, it was, I was like, nah, and then on Friday night, you said something that really made me change. And, and I think for anyone who's listening, that's why I always go on and on and [00:37:00] on about knowing what you want to do in life. I think that's the first, like dreaming big and really make it clear what you want to do, because we can do anything, but we can't do everything.

And I think it's really important to kind of know what to say yes and no to. And first I said no, but then I said yes, because I just felt like, To do that with you as an experience. And then it was kind of really perfect timing in so many ways, but it also wasn't, and then doing the pros and cons really quickly.

And then, you know, we were, I think we, so we landed back or I don't know if you call it landed, but we were back on, on the land on Saturday morning and on Tuesday night Well, Tuesday morning, we flew to, to Buenos Aires and Tuesday night, we were at a welcome dinner because I used to do crazy trips like that, where you just go flying for 22 hours or 24 hours and sometimes longer, and then go straight to an event.

I was like, I don't want to do this anymore, but with you, it's just like, yeah, let's do it. And so we

Sarah: kept looking [00:38:00] at each other on the plane and giggling, didn't we? We were like two little school girls. It was so exciting.

Kristina: So I think, I mean, for me, it was still, for me, it was like the highlight would definitely the nature of the light, the, you know, the landings being a water, you know, I wasn't going to do canoeing because I was like, you know, I don't like the cold.

So I was like, Oh, it might be too cold or too, too choppy, but gosh, that was amazing. And I wasn't going to do the cold plunge because I'm like, I'm Swedish. I don't do it in Sweden. So why would I do it on a tactic? And then I was like. Oh, maybe I should do it.

Sarah: You honestly, you just, you were my rockstar.

Cause like you just kept pushing yourself outside of your comfort zone and challenging when you were thinking, Oh, I don't really do that. And you did it. And you just, both of us, I think, live on the edge like that. We love kind of leaning into what's that thing I'm saying no to, and why am I saying no to it?

And what would happen if I said yes. And on the other side of that kind of, yes, was just so much energy and joy. [00:39:00] And, you know, we both fell in love with Antarctica. It is such a beautiful, magical, pristine, incredible place. And I think every person that went down there felt more connected to our planet than we probably have in such a long time, you know, it's.

It's whales coming up to your, you know, Zodiac or a little seal coming in, like playing. And it was just mind blowing, wasn't it?

Kristina: And I, I think my favorite part, I mean, there was so many favorite parts, but you know that passage, I'm not sure what it's called, but it's,

Sarah: Oh yes. The Lemur passage. Oh my goodness.

So quiet. I have never, I've never had a more breathtaking moment in my life. We were having, I was having a spicy mango margarita with the snow falling on my face Looking at these giant, what I wasn't expecting was for Antarctica to have so many mountains and all these mountains that sort of like closed in this, this beautiful channel and yeah, it was snowing and quiet and you [00:40:00] could hear the crisp kind of like as the boat like crunched up against an iceberg.

Kristina: Yeah, yeah, it was so amazing. And then I had a couple of days in Buenos Aires, which I always wanted to do. And it was just so nice. And what I love is when you make decisions and because I'm so clear, like I want to work and travel the world. So I want to combine it because I love working and I love traveling and I love new, new environments.

I love everything. Inspiring people. So when I travel, I want to make sure I travel with people who, who I feel like are, you know, big dreamers or entrepreneurs and people who are really thinking big and it's just incredible because, you know, even like having Simon Bowman is going to come on the podcast, like sitting there on a dinner, doing models on my new, my new.

I was just like, Oh my God, this is so amazing. And then you, you look to the left and there's an iceberg or a penguin or a group of penguins. Like it's just so amazing. And

Sarah: it was so amazing. So we do have a bit of a dream. I'll have to see what you think about this. Cause it's, and we'll have to see what the [00:41:00] listeners think and get them to give us some feedback.

But we, we thought that we should get together a group of really, really inspiring, amazing entrepreneurs and go back for international women's day, 2006.

Kristina: I think that's a brilliant idea to speak, to speak like for international women's day on the cruise in Antarctica with all these incredible women. Like it was just such a, it was

Sarah: like, we got pretty bad ass, didn't we? And we had an all women landing. On to the Antarctic continent on International Women's Day, which was just, you know, when you think about it, obviously Antarctica has been explored for the last, I think it's a couple of hundred years, you know, there's wonderful stories of Shackleton and, you know, even Peter Hillary is like walked across Antarctica and discovered various, I think the South Pole, those sorts of things.

But like to have, you know, I think it was like 58 women at once on, on a particular landing was just [00:42:00] incredible. It was such a good feeling.

Kristina: That's a good one. Let's so for anyone listening, that's a good one to kind of put into your list of dreams. I want to shift gear a little bit now. One thing that I've noticed with you and this will be interesting for everyone who's kind of thinking about going to Shea Balls or the Fiji Retreat or perhaps now Antarctica.

You need to do a landing page so we can send everyone for a waitlist. But anyway, I'm sure we have lots of because when I Went, I had so many of my friends saying, Oh gosh, that's on my list. And I think doing it the way we did, it was such a beautiful experience. But one thing that I think people be thinking right now is like, how do I do it all?

So you have five children, but you know, between you and Steve and you live in two countries and you run your own business and you travel so much and you always take time to answer the phone when I call you. How do you do it all? Because I think people will be thinking that you are a you cut from [00:43:00] a special cloth or, or, or have something that we don't know.

Sarah: I'm actually, I actually think it's important for people to know that I'm super neurodiverse and I actually have to have more tools in place than a neurotypical person to be able to do it all. So I think. That's just a disclaimer, but because of that, I have found epic tools to really support my own weaknesses.

So for example, I, I suffer from time blindness. So I lose time really easily. And so because of that, I went and studied all these productivity tools, you know, the Palme d'Era method and the various kind of agile and like lean and all these different things. And I came up with a couple of different tools for myself.

I'm six Sigma study and all of that sort of amazing stuff. And what I found was if I Shifted my mindset to time abundance, so I have like this time abundance mindset, so I don't allow myself to ever say, I don't have the time. I do have the time. I have to make very careful choices around where I invest [00:44:00] my energy into the finite amount of hours and days that there are within the days, etc.

And then my husband and I have got a whole heap of really epic tools that some people use in their business that we use to optimize our life. So we use Notion. We have a full 18 month calendar that we keep really like dialed in to make sure we know who's where and what's happening. And so we don't miss any of the kind of big important milestones.

And then we do design sprints. So like I'm a designer, like design thinking is my jam. Like I am the happiest if I'm front of like a mirror board or a fig jam board or a white board with a whole heap of post it notes. And I actually think that bringing intentionality to your dreams. And then like getting crystal clear, like you do around like, well, this is the year and this is what's possible with the resources that I have available this year.

There's a really cool method actually called the power method where you look at like your projects, you look at your areas, you look at your resources and you look at what you need to archive. [00:45:00] And I think that's, Being crystal clear on what you say no to is as important as what you say yes to. So we kill a lot of stuff and I don't know if you saw this, Christina, but I shared a video on LinkedIn a couple of weeks ago of me like crying because we were closing the one lab, which was one of our business ventures in Auckland.

I was so sad because it was such a cool project. You know, it had infrared saunas and ice bath and Pilates reformers and an innovation lab. Like it was so cool, but for us, like being really real about our resources and our goals and our dreams, it was a dream to open it. And I'm so glad we did. I have zero regrets, but we had to make a conscious decision to close it.

And That was a, you know, so I try and normalize, like, I think you should have all the dreams in the whole entire planet. I think you should bring as many of them to life as possible, but then I think you need to choose the ones that are really working for you because there's this difference between like some of my dreams when I brought them to [00:46:00] life.

I've been like, Oh, you're not as pretty in the real world as I expected. You know, like, have you ever had that experience where you've got, got this big dream and then you start to actually do it and you're like, Oh, and I, I see this with people who have like dream businesses and I ask them, and I know this is provocative, but I'm like, Oh, do you really love like bass statements and like GST?

And do you love like board meetings? And do you love reporting? And do you love, and they're like, no, I hate all of that. And I'm like, Maybe you just love marketing. Like maybe you just love photography. Maybe you just love podcasts. Like maybe there's a slither of the stream that you actually need to like harness and harvest and like pull that through.

So probably the thing that Steve and I have become. Really good at is like harvesting the moments, the micro moments of all of those dreams that we like crazily go off and make happen. And we actually sit down and go of that thing that we made, you know, the wonder lab, the Antarctica [00:47:00] retreat, the she evolves experience, the innovation workshop, whatever of that, like, which bit was the best, which bit gave us the most energy and which bit felt like dessert.

And then I really believe in like creating a life of like dessert stomach. So it's like, you know how you have room for dessert, you've always got room even when you're really full. Well, I think people have that for dreams and like things that they want to do. It was like Antarctica. You made it happen.

Even though you didn't have the time.

Kristina: I completely get it. Dessert mom, just because I'm not a sweet person, I'm like, I always have room for cheese.

Sarah: Yeah. Cheese. Okay. I'm a cheese person too. So it's like the cheese stomach. And it's like, what if you really understood what cheese or dessert was for you in a work context?

And then you like distilled all of your days into just doing those things. And like, for me, Retreats, you know, podcasts, writing spending time, coaching people, running innovation, masterclasses, doing keynote speaking. Like [00:48:00] those are the things that like, they light me up so much. And so if I'm doing those, like, it doesn't even matter.

I can just do those for days. And so I can then sequence and prioritize my beautiful family, my amazing friends, my incredible, like other things, cause I'm only doing really amazing stuff. So that's just like how we kind of do it. I know that's like a five minute kind of journey, but I think there's some bits in there that might resonate for people just around like thinking differently, paradigm shifting and like experimenting to kind of harvest and get the good stuff.

Kristina: Yeah, I love, love that thinking. So, I would love for you to share your morning ritual.

Sarah: Yep. I'm so sad you asked me this because I used to have such a good morning ritual. I'm in redesign mode because I've moved to Melbourne. So I'll tell you my Auckland one, and then I'm going to tell you my Melbourne one.

And I want to share light because I think it's really important. If people don't have a morning ritual, it's [00:49:00] okay. Like just be gentle with yourself because maybe you just haven't designed it yet. Okay. So my New Zealand morning ritual is so cute because one of the kids always brings me a coffee just as I wake up.

And then one of them opens the curtains up and we get to like overlook the beautiful beach that we live on and we set intentions and we say what we're grateful for. And then I get up and. Start to do breakfast and basically like, it's a lunchbox line up, right? It's five lunch boxes. It's like this whole production line and it's really beautiful.

And I always used to try and make time to go outside and like ground my feet on the grass and just have that really like intentional moment of just, even if it was like five minutes. 15 to 25 seconds for me before like the chaos of the day started. So it was pretty good with that. And I absolutely loved it.

And then when I moved to Melbourne, because I'm now redesigning with two kids, no one's bringing me coffee. So

my own coffee [00:50:00] and it's just messing with my whole vibe, but no, I still start my day with coffee and I still do Very much try and start with intentionality. So it's like, what do I want to kind of achieve or get out of today? You know, I checked my diary and kind of, I just feel like I'm a bit more business first in Melbourne, if that makes sense, probably because I don't have to make as many lunches and things like that.

So I don't know if your listeners have tips for me in redesigning morning rituals in Melbourne. Hit me up.

Kristina: I mean, I think you do in so many ways because you often, you often share, because you have such amazing view from where you live now with the sunrise. That's like, it was a sunset. Like either of those two, you often share.

So I think you're very intentional already. And it was so amazing to meet someone who loves journaling as much as I do. And so there's probably quite a lot of things. And I think everyone has a morning ritual. It's just really, if they're, if it's the one that they really want to do. And if there's something that's exciting, because, you know, we also, are in different stages of life.

So for example, with the five lunchboxes, that's like a, let's say [00:51:00] like a small period of your life versus, you know, now it's very different for me. What, you know, five years ago, what it is today and will be in the next five years. So I think just, we all have one. It's just really, What that means and how much you'd love that.

Sarah: And it's funny you say that because my morning ritual with the lunchbox making is very intentional. I think of that as this amazing, beautiful opportunity to create like goodness and healthiness and love. And like I put notes in the kids lunchboxes or jokes or like I hide things, you know, so I, I make that like a really playful start to my day.

And and I've done that. for God knows how long. So like, yeah, that's, it's funny when you start talking about something and you bring that awareness to it, you're like, there's more intentionality there than I realized.

Kristina: Yeah. And also I think sometimes we do things without, you know, thinking, oh, that's not very special, but it's unique for you.

And you know, and sometimes we'd be like, actually, I want to add something else. And and, you know, and I think, especially when we have young kids, it's much harder. We can [00:52:00] start thinking about what we like to do. And you know, for me that's like my meditation, my journaling, and my walking and my coffee for five minutes in silence.

It's like, I just love it. Like, it's so simple, but it's so beautiful. But but you're also really good because you go out for breakfast, like often when I was calling you, you're out for breakfast, so you definitely have it. It's just I take myself out for

Sarah: breakfast like once a week. Yeah. I think that that's a really like taking yourself on a date.

You and I both love the walking thing. I'm super passionate about meditation. I moved my meditation practice to nighttime just because of everything going on with all the kids and that sort of thing. And I was just finding like, I need, I need to do a few breaths during the middle of the day just to like reset and realign.

And then I do more of an intentional meditation reflection session of an evening before I go to sleep. And that's really super powerful for me. Yeah.

Kristina: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I think then. Evening routine is as important, but it's harder to do because you don't control that as much because there's often people involved in [00:53:00] that versus the morning.

You can actually make yours if you get up before everyone else,

Sarah: but when the morning, when the day is how Elrod says, doesn't he? I love that.

Kristina: Yeah, absolutely. So the other thing I wanted to ask you, just two more questions. One is have you got a favorite book or a book that had a very big impact on your life or a big impact on your life?

Sarah: Yeah. Oh my God. I love books. I have so many books. If I think about books that have had impact on my life, Brene Brown's Braving the Wilderness genuinely changed my life. And so did Mark Mansell's Subtle Art because I was at a position in my life where I kind of knew my relationship was transitioning.

And it really gave me the courage to see it for where it was and for what it was. And, and to like really own what it was. my part of the story without ever having to like create these characters that were like bad, you know, it was like, actually I can just own that this is where I am. And this is what's happening next.

And it's [00:54:00] not like I have so much love. For my previous partners and anyone in my life because of those books, because they just really helped me take radical responsibility and like create change from a place of full ownership. So I fully recommend them to anybody who wants to kind of go there, but it does, it really unleashes a lot of bravery.

Kristina: Absolutely. Can you say, can you repeat the second one?

Sarah: The subtle art of not giving up.

Kristina: Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. That's what I thought you said, but I just wanted to double check. So thank you for that. Cause everyone loves hearing their, their book tips. So my last questions to you is knowing what you know now, what kind of advice would you give to yourself?

Say. You know, your late teens.

Sarah: Love it. It is what makes you weird or uncomfortable about yourself is actually what makes you cool. And if you just sit with that for a second, you're going to realize that it's making [00:55:00] you uncomfortable because it's bad. It's actually big. And I actually tell this to my kids all the time because I don't want them to be homogenized or feel like they need to like sacrifice parts of themselves to fit in.

And I just think there's a generation of really Really incredible children who need a little bit more hope. And so I also would want them to know like every, I want every child, every 14, every 16, every human on planet earth to know, you know, you're amazing. Like every single, but there's room for us all to be amazing.

It doesn't have to be that someone's more amazing than you or that like, They're better than you. Like, it's just, you're amazing and taking the time to really fall deeply in love with your quirks and what makes you a bit weird is, is okay and beautiful. And I think if we can all just love what's weird about ourselves, that actually creates a lot of space on the planet.

Kristina: I love that. And that's so, [00:56:00] so perfect answer for this incredible discussion, you know, we could, we could actually speak forever. And I just want to say. Thank you. And I really hope that our listeners are inspired to go on a retreat. If it's our retreats or your retreats or any retreats, it's just about any

Sarah: retreat, go on a retreat.

Yeah, there's so many good retreats here

Kristina: for anyone who is in Australia or, but you know, you can travel because I think that's makes it even more exciting because you then we do know that Kendra is coming from us, for example, I love that. So I'm excited about catching up with her before. So, so I, I think it's amazing that.

You are giving us that opportunity to come to all join it. She also thank you for sharing all your wisdom with us. And I'm really excited to have you back once you launch your book, which we're going to talk about next time. Thank you. Thank you so much. [00:57:00] Wow. How inspiring is Sarah? Gosh, I just love her attitude to life and I just can't wait to speak and attend.

She involves the retreat in Byron Bay. I hope to see some of you there. I will link to it in the show notes. As always, I'll be back on Monday with a new Monday morning motivation episode. I'll see you then.


Leave a comment

Please note, comments must be approved before they are published

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.