#484 - Transform Your Health from the Inside Out, with Donna Aston

Hi there, and welcome back to another episode 💛

Today I'm joined by nutritionist, author and Aston RX founder Donna Aston for a conversation that made me want to take notes from beginning to end.

Donna has spent more than 30 years working across health, fitness and nutrition.

What I loved most about our conversation is that she brings both professional knowledge and lived experience.

She understands how confusing health advice can feel, especially when every new headline, product and social media post seems to offer a different answer.

Together, we explore what Donna calls our ‘inside health’: the systems and daily habits that can influence how we feel, rather than a single number on the scales.

We also talk about Donna’s own transformation, her book Inside Health, breaking unhelpful habits and learning to trust yourself.

As always, I’d LOVE to hear what resonated most with you - so please share and let’s keep the conversation going in the Dream Life Podcast Facebook Group here.    

Have a wonderful weekend …and remember, it all starts with a dream 💛

Dream Life & kikki.K Founder

SHOW NOTES:

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TRANSCRIPT:

Kristina: Hi there, and welcome back to another episode of Your Dream Life podcast. Today, I'm sitting down with Donna Aston. She's a nutritionist, founder of Aston Rx, and author of her seventh book, Inside Health. Donna has spent over 30 years in health, fitness, and nutrition, helping thousands of people move past quick fixes and actually understand what's happening inside their bodies.

[00:01:51] In this episode, we are going into metabolic health, gut health, and the myth that keeps us stuck, and what real, lasting change looks [00:02:00] like. I absolutely loved this conversation, and I have no doubt that you will too. Let's get right into it

[00:02:11] Kristina: Well, hello Donna, and a very warm welcome. I am so excited to have you on my podcast

[00:02:17] Donna: I'm thrilled to be here. Thank you so much for having me

[00:02:20] Kristina: Well, thank you. As I said earlier, I have been watching your journey from, from afar for a very long time. Lots of my friends train with you and have done lots of your programs, et cetera. So I was so excited to read your newest book, and that's what we're gonna talk about, and all your programs and all the amazing things that you are doing.

[00:02:40] But before we jump in, I want to, um, ask you one question that I ask everyone. Did you have a dream as a child, something you maybe wanted to do or have or become?

[00:02:51] Donna: Interesting. When I was quite young, I loved makeup I wanted to be a makeup artist, basically. I've got two older sisters. One's eight years older, and the other's 10 years older. So when I was little, they were getting ready to go to nightclubs and go out at night and paint their face, and I would just sit there in fascination watching.

[00:03:09] And so that was what I wanted to do, and I actually did, train as a beauty therapist and makeup artist at one stage, and did it for a short time, and then managed to fall

[00:03:19] into the fitness side of things, and that just happened organically

[00:03:23] Kristina: Yeah.

[00:03:24] Fantastic. I love that. I love that. And I think, um, I think even though beauty is kind of, um, maybe not part of health, but I think it is because I think when you feel good, you live a healthier life, all those. I think it's all connected. Um, and we're gonna talk a lot about that everything is connected today.

[00:03:39] But, for anyone who's listening, so we, our podcast is a global podcast, so not everyone across the world might have heard about you yet. So I'd love for you to just maybe share a little bit about your journey, because I have no doubt that you have seen some crazy, crazy things, and also, um, [00:04:00] I would just say a radical transformation.

[00:04:01] 'Cause I do feel like, it's getting very clear on what we should and shouldn't do, although it's probably very, um, confusing still because there's So many different opinions and different views perhaps from people that don't really know. So I I'm super excited about going into that. But maybe give a little bit of a background about your journey.

[00:04:24] Donna: So I grew up as a, a fairly active teenager. Didn't really think much about what I ate or anything else. You know, played sport and did gymnastics and was fairly slim. I'm quite tall, so I'm about five foot eight. so I was that height when I was 12. So I was always tall and quite slim, and then I got to about 16 and I stopped growing that way, and I started growing sideways which was a bit of a shock to me 'cause I'd never really thought about it, and my diet wasn't good, but I sort of got away with it.

[00:04:59] And then I, I realised that I just felt really uncomfortable. I felt unhealthy. I didn't have much energy anymore. I felt uncomfortable in my clothes. I didn't like it. And so I tried every fad, everything that everyone's ever done. My attention span for the gym was, was like a goldfish. You know, I just... I didn't sort of see much happen when I went, so I just didn't really enjoy it.

[00:05:27] And I went through a few cycles of that with some different crazy diets that we've all done. And then a friend of mine dragged me into this very serious gym, which frightened me to death because it was full of men who were all sweating and grunting. and we walked in, and they were really friendly.

[00:05:48] We started training. My friend ended up not training after a few weeks, and I just loved it. And all these guys were helping me with my training, and [00:06:00] I started seeing and feeling results, and I really enjoyed it, and I was actually pretty good at it. So I set myself a goal over the next couple of years to do a, like, a fitness competition So I worked really hard.

[00:06:15] I enjoyed every second of it. I learnt lots of things to do and not to do with training and diet and things. And I went from around forty percent body fat to about eight percent body fat in two years. So the transformation was really substantial. And everyone in the gym who saw me transform started coming up to me and saying, "What have you done?

[00:06:40] can you help me do that?" And so this is how I ended up falling into training other people. Um, I then went and studied training and got my certificate, and then I officially started training people 'cause I just loved helping other people do what I had done. and it started to build organically from there.

[00:06:58] And then I realised there was so much more to it and how important the nutrition side of it was. So then I went and did a degree in nutrition as well and then ended up opening my own gyms over the years, more sort of personal training studios, exclusive personal training studios. Have trained lots of high-profile business people and celebrities and things, which I suppose is, how I've got a reputation along the way.

[00:07:23] I've written, um, seven books now, published seven books, and now focus more on the nutrition side of things in the last five or six years, more from the digital, um, health side of things. So we have a health tech company called Insight Health

[00:07:37] Kristina: Yeah

[00:07:37] I love this journey because you're coming from experience as well as knowledge. So I think there are a lot of people who have a lot of theory but actually haven't lived it, and I think there's nothing like living it. And quite similar in a very different field, but in the kind of business world I started with, with, uh, Kiki Kay was all about, you know, product for your home office, and then a- [00:08:00] as I evolved as a person, I started to be really interested in how I could keep work-life balance.

[00:08:06] And when I say work-life balance, I think that is season. I don't think, I don't believe in this kind of 50/50. I think some seasons, you know, if we, we can focus on one thing, we might be able to do that, so I'm not talking about that perfect balance here, just to cl- clarify, because I think people get hanged up on things, and that's the question that I got the most.

[00:08:25] But what I love about that is that now I can... I run a coaching program myself, and I love that I can help people, not just kind of with business, but actually not getting burnt out and, and enjoy the journey. Because, you know, at the end of the day, it's like enjoying our life and not just focusing on, grinding and, you know, your book, Inside Health, is very much around that, like not just focusing on the calories and the looking good.

[00:08:50] It's about, you know, enjoying life.

[00:08:52] Donna: Absolutely. Yeah. And I think from the experience side of things, it helps that I've been overweight. I think a lot of health and fitness people have never experienced that, and it's very hard to relate to people who are struggling to lose weight and are in that vulnerable position if you haven't been there yourself.

[00:09:10] And often people will meet me who don't know much about me and will say, "Oh, well, you're lucky. You're, you're fit." and it's no, I, There's a fat girl inside here and I know what it feels like, and I know, how difficult it is to commit to making the change

[00:09:25] Kristina: Yeah

[00:09:26] absolutely. Absolutely. So let's dive into your book. So Inside Health, I, will recommend that and will link to that. I, I loved it so much. I'm actually gonna re- so I read it, for preparing for this interview, but I, I'm a reader with pen and some, also have a book club, and, uh, some people there, get so nervous when I, I take a lot of notes in my books because I feel like, you know, it's my book to, you know, implement the things that I'm learning.

[00:09:52] And there are so m- so many highlights here, so I can't wait. I have this little practice where I, I live in, um, in Sydney and, [00:10:00] around the corner I have a sauna, kind of thing. Uh, what's it called? Extra clubs. And, um, I go there and I do, at night I do a red, red light, uh, or infrared sauna so it's not super hot, and then I can read.

[00:10:14] And I love reading about health because often if I read business books, I get a bit too excited on the things that I wanna implement. But with health, I'm just like, "That's like such a, such a treat and such a privilege to be able to focus on my health." So that's just a little bit about how much I love the book, so I highly recommend everyone get a copy.

[00:10:33] But I'd like to talk about, first, before we dive into the, the details of the book, is you've written seven books and, I haven't read all your seven books, but I feel like this book is like really, I would assume, but love to hear your opinion of course, that this is like the best of your work.

[00:10:51] Because I feel like now it's s- the science behind things, because I feel like I've always focused on, on my health, but I don't, I'm not an expert, but I find it really hard to talk about health and wellbeing in a, um, what I consider quite normal. We have normalized all the crazy stuff in my opinion, like the, you know, so many things.

[00:11:12] And, uh, I'm not, I'm not an expert, I'm also not perfect just to put it out there. But I'd love to hear your opinion because with all the fads and all the things and all the, you know, with biohacking, I absolutely love reading about all that. But I think if sometimes if we don't get the basics right, there's no point

[00:11:29] Donna: Laying the foundation is absolutely important. And, and yes, thank you. I feel like this is my best book because we know so much more. I mean, my first book I published in 1999, so I can't believe it's nearly thirty years ago. and while the principles of what I do haven't really changed, there's a lot more science behind the reasons that I was recommending what I was thirty years ago.

[00:11:54] So, so for that, I'm really grateful to have so much knowledge. And we've done, um, [00:12:00] clinical trials ourselves as well now along the way, which has been really exciting. So that sort of further solidifies all of the science behind what we do. but I think that there are so many conflicting things out there, you know, when it comes to health, and it's really important to understand that a lot of it is marketing, you know.

[00:12:18] And social media, everyone's an expert, you know? Everyone's an expert. So I'm a bit of a geek, and I love to read scientific literature. And then my goal is to be able to translate that into layman's terms to help people to understand it. And I use, case studies and analogies and things to sort of normalize it for people so that they can really understand it.

[00:12:41] I think the first comment that I often get from people is, "Why doesn't everyone know this?" when people start doing my online program and they start to understand the reasoning behind everything they've been experiencing, not only is it a real relief that there's nothing wrong with them and that they can understand why they're experiencing what they're experiencing, and it's not their destiny because they're getting older or because of their genetics or what it i- whatever it is, and they start to understand that they've got a lot more control over that than they thought.

[00:13:13] It's quite empowering for people, and that's the bit I love. to show people their superpowers and how they can really change things is what I love to do

[00:13:22] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah. absolutely. So I had a lady in my program, she did your, I think It's RX28. Is that the correct name?

[00:13:31] Donna: Yeah. It's Aston RX. Yeah, and it's a 28-day metabolic

[00:13:34] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, it was so amazing when, she talked about it because she, um, she said that she-- when her kind of hormonal changes started, she, you know, she's put weight on.

[00:13:49] And then, we had a theme in our program. where we kind of got rid of clutter. I always feel like when you get rid of things, in your environment, you start thinking about, like [00:14:00] you just feel you're freeing up your mind, and then you l- you do all the things. And she did the-- your program and our kind of decluttering, um, kind of challenge at the same time.

[00:14:10] And, uh, I had a, um, a-- I don't do one-on-one, but we did like a, catch-up thing. And, uh, it was so inspiring because she was just... I felt like she had so much energy. So do you wanna... I wanna, I wanna go deeper on lots of things, but I'd love to talk about that because I think, like I laugh because there's like protein now on every single thing in the supermarket

[00:14:33] And, um, you know, it's like the, the, I guess, the, you know... And I understand protein is really important, but I think it's perhaps gone a little bit crazy in, in all the marketing. But definitely, uh, I think most of us need more protein. So do you wanna talk about that program? 'Cause I'd love to i- in, in the coaching program, which you are gonna come in and talk, uh, deeper on this.

[00:14:52] I, I'm so excited because I think if we can get that right, then lots of other things will follow.

[00:14:58] Donna: Yeah. So, the macronutrients that we have, so protein, carbohydrates and fats, there's so much conflicting information out there about all of them. And generally, they're trying to sell you a product of some sort that relates to that. And like you said, you go to the supermarket now and there's high protein yogurt, high protein everything.

[00:15:15] I mean, there's, there's a, a meme I saw the other day on Instagram, which was, you know, protein in pretty much everything you could think of.

[00:15:22] Kristina: Yeah

[00:15:22] Donna: And yes, um, as we get older and certainly, for women over the age of 50, we start to not absorb and assimilate protein as well. So we do need a good quality of protein and we need to have an adequate amount.

[00:15:37] That doesn't mean that more is better. Um, sometimes, you know, people think, "Well, if this much is, is what I need, then if I have twice as much, it's even better." Well, your body can't absorb or assimilate that much. So it's about just having a balance in each of your meals. So each meal should have a portion of protein.

[00:15:54] animal source protein is actually better assimilated and has a better amino acid profile than [00:16:00] plant-based proteins. If you are doing plant-based, then you need to be quite diligent and knowledgeable about the amino acids and how to combine foods because you will end up deficient in something. there's an amino acid called leucine which is amazing for building muscle and that's in most of your animal-based proteins.

[00:16:17] But alongside that protein you need your fibrous, colorful plant foods. We recommend people have 20 to 30 different plant foods every week to try to get that diversity for your gut microbiome. And then of course, unrefined healthy fats and oils are also a really important part of every meal, um, for so many different functions in our body.

[00:16:37] And I think we became very fat phobic back in the '70s and '80s and that stuck like glue and a lot of people are still quite frightened of eating fats even if they're sort of healthy, unrefined fats and oils. So protein is great for, repairing our tissue, muscle tissue after exercise, our skin.

[00:16:58] It's important for everything. But like I said, it's, it's a balance in that meal. It's not just one thing that everyone's focusing on. And also most important is strength training for muscle tissue and having good metabolic flexibility. So having good control over your blood glucose

[00:17:16] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah. love all that and completely makes sense. So, the title Inside Health, why that title? And, uh, tell everyone who's listening what What's the, the big message, from your book?

[00:17:31] Donna: Mm. It's funny, the title came from, when I speak to people and I'm often-- people are talking about how much they weigh on the scales and they've had this number and they've had this scan done and that this is their body fat percentage and this is their visceral fat score and this is their bone density and, this is about their gut health.

[00:17:49] And I keep hearing all of these things that we talk about and they're all connected. And I keep, keep saying to people, "It's not just about how much you weigh. It's about your inside [00:18:00] health. It's about what's going on on the inside." And that means your microbiome health. That means your insulin sensitivity and your metabolic flexibility.

[00:18:09] So being agile enough to be able to switch between burning glucose and burning fat for fuel, which is how we're supposed to function. And so everything I talk about is basically getting to the root cause, not looking at all the symptoms. Uh, if somebody's carrying excess weight, which is the main catalyst for people coming to me or to my programme, is because they've gained weight.

[00:18:33] And we all know when our jeans don't do up properly and our clothes don't fit well and we don't like the way we look in the mirror. So we can see body fat. And so that's generally the reason that people will come to me for help, not realising that that body fat is a symptom of something that's going on on the inside.

[00:18:51] And so we will do blood pathology testing. We will find generally that they may be insulin resistant, that they've got a whole host of things going on on the inside. And once we explain them to the person and they start to understand how their body's functioning and why it's behaving the way that it is, and we fix those things on the inside, the body fat will fix itself.

[00:19:15] But so does inflammation. It's-- People will often say, "Oh, I'm losing weight, but guess what? I don't have reflux anymore. My knees don't hurt when I go to the gym." you know, all these things that they had accepted as normal that, "Oh, it's just 'cause I'm getting older," they're wrong. And they realise that by fixing the systemic inflammation, the insulin resistance, all the things that were underlying the problems, all the symptoms start to disappear.

[00:19:43] And it's so exciting for people when they realise that they can reverse those things

[00:19:47] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. It makes so, so mu- sense. most of the people that I, coach and who's in my community, you know, are, um, you know, midlife, and that could obviously ma- vary, [00:20:00] in age. But that's kind of the, demographic that I work on, work with, and it's, um, it's very much, an issue, like, as the hormones changes, sleep, gaining weight, lots of things.

[00:20:15] And it's funny because I consider myself pretty healthy and, uh, I, um, One of my closest friend, she is 10 years older than me, and I was watching her, going through that, and I was thinking, "I'm gonna breeze it through just like she did." But I didn't, and it was, uh, a- and you know, everything that I have a uh, challenge with, I take as a great lesson for me because you know, I lost my business and now I have so much compassion for people who are struggling in business.

[00:20:43] I, I like to look at all my challenges as blessings that I can then support other people in. 'Cause, you know, as you said before, if you didn't have that weight issue when you were younger, perhaps you couldn't help the same way. So I am curious, for people who are in midlife and starting to gain that weight and, you know, sleeping less because of hormone disturbance, all those kind of things, where should they actually start?

[00:21:09] So obviously they're gonna read your book, but just to kind of get people start when they are, um, listening to this podcast.

[00:21:17] Donna: Hmm. Interestingly, so from the age of thirty-five onwards, we start to lose one percent of our lean muscle tissue every year if we're not training really hard to keep it. So muscle is your metabolic engine, and so if your engine is getting smaller and smaller and smaller, by the time you're fifty, you've potentially lost fifteen percent of your engine.

[00:21:39] And so you're still eating the same and you're saying, "Well, why am I gaining weight? Because I'm still eating the same." Yes, but your engine is smaller. Now, you're also potentially becoming insulin resistant and there's many things from stress, poor sleep, meal timing, so many different things that I speak about in the book that can impact that.

[00:21:58] But if you're [00:22:00] becoming more insulin resistant, then that really has an effect on inflammation. It's all tied in really tightly with hormone health. So your endocrine system, your hormone system, and your metabolic system are linked very tightly. And so if one is not well, the other one is not well. And so there are certain things we can control through that period.

[00:22:23] Now, obviously, our hormones will start to decline, and this is inevitable. It's, it's what happens. You will manage it best if you have really good metabolic health. And the things you can focus on are strength training to keep your muscles and bones strong, and stop that deterioration because estrogen is no longer protective of your muscle and bones as we get older.

[00:22:47] So focusing on doing s- three strength sessions a week that are progressive load, proper strength sessions. Not Pilates, not yoga. Strength. So lifting weight and progressively heavier weight. focusing on-- I talk about meal timing, which is really important, and getting in sync with your circadian rhythms.

[00:23:06] That helps our sleep. So if you're eating late at night, when you go to sleep, your body needs to drop your temperature to its lowest point, and you need to start producing melatonin. This is how we have the onset of sleep. If you eat late, you stop that process happening. Your temperature goes up, and you stop producing melatonin.

[00:23:26] you have one poor night's sleep, you're thirty percent more insulin resistant the next day, which means you're starving, hungry, and you're picking at all sorts of things all day long because it's biological. It's not willpower. It's actually your biology. So once you start to understand this, you prioritise your sleep, you work hard on sleep hygiene, all the things you need to do to prepare yourself to sleep well.

[00:23:49] Then you're well-rested, you wake up, your cortisol levels are where they should be. All of these things that we can control, we need to focus on. Making sure that we're having quality [00:24:00] protein, each meal is balanced. We're allowing some metabolic rest in between meals, so I like to allow at least five hours rest in between meals.

[00:24:09] Grazing and snacking is about the worst thing you can do. So there's a lot of things we can control through that period of time and forever. But if we start doing that as soon as we learn about it, whether you're thirty-five or twenty-five or sixty-five, you'll find that once you give your body what it needs, your body is amazing.

[00:24:32] And it can repair things and get back into sync with everything it needs to really fast. I often have-- I had one, woman who was a, a fitness instructor up in Sydney, and she was doing several classes a day. And she was in her early fi-fifties, and she was taking Nurofen every day because her knees were so sore and she had so many aches and pains.

[00:24:55] And it was her job, so she didn't have a lot of choice. And she realised-- She contacted me about two weeks into the program, and she said, "I just realised I haven't taken Nurofen for ten days." because she didn't need it anymore. And this is someone who was fit, but she just didn't have the food side of it.

[00:25:13] There was a few things that she needed to get in sync with from a sleep and a nourishment point of view, and her inflammation levels just plummeted, and she just felt like a new woman. So There's a lot of those things that we can control, and that helps to stabilise our endocrine system and the changes that our hormones are going through throughout that time and beyond

[00:25:37] Kristina: Yeah

[00:25:37] I love that because I actually had a knee issue not that long ago, and it was really, for someone who, uh, walking is like my mental health. Like, I, I need to walk every day 'cause that's how I kind of process everything. And when I couldn't, it was real. And that's how I kinda got into i- sauna and, uh, a little bit of cold immersions just so I could do something to kinda ke- keep me, [00:26:00] uh, in a good space.

[00:26:01] and I, I went to see someone for my knee, but I kept thinking it's not, it, because it wasn't in one place. I was like, "I'm not gonna do anything drastic here 'cause I actually think I can fix it." And, uh, um, now it's so much better, and, um, now I just need to, to build strength. But there was a couple of things I wanted to, uh, I wanna talk about snacking because I see a lot, and this is also from, my own experience.

[00:26:25] So I, I have been doing kind of a, kind of quarterly detox, meaning I kinda just, get rid of all the excess stuff for, um, you know, one week or three weeks, and it's just, it's just really helpful for me to kinda reset myself and, uh, because I feel like after holidays and things, things s- snack in without you realising.

[00:26:45] And, uh, I wanna talk about snacking, and I also wanna talk about alcohol. And I was actually at a talk that you did for YPO maybe two years ago. I, I can't even remember. Maybe it's three years ago now. And as you were speaking, I f- 'cause I, I sat close to you and I see... I saw you didn't eat, so you didn't eat late, and I saw you didn't drink, and I did the same.

[00:27:05] because one thing that I realized since I got my Oura Ring, I realized that as soon as I eat late, I just don't... The quality of sleep is really bad. So yes, there are certain nights where I might choose to eat because I'm out or something, but I... that's really changed for me, which has been a really, really amazing.

[00:27:24] And I also quit alcohol because it just wasn't worth it for me. So can we talk a little bit about alcohol? Because I was at dinner last year sometimes, and, um, we were in a, at a shared table, and so it was just, like, lots of different pastas and things coming in. And then I handed over a tomato-based pasta, and the lady there's, she said, um...

[00:27:47] I didn't know her, and she said to me, "Nah, it doesn't agree with me in menopause." And I w- so I was like, "Oh, okay." And then she just poured up, like, this was her second bottle of wine. And it made me laugh because I think [00:28:00] I've pro- oh, and I've s- I'm sure you've seen these many thing. And you know, I used to drink, uh, definitely, um, lots of alcohol in my younger years, so I'm just sharing this because it was such a eye-opener that I think we forget the basics. and, uh, the more I learn about alcohol and the more I think definitely hormonal changes, was a trigger for me. I was like, "It's just not worth it." And, uh, I also felt like I'm gonna give everything that I've got to my new business, and I didn't wanna have sleepless nights, so that was another really, um, I think having reasons behind it is really important.

[00:28:33] So for anyone who's drinking that kinda one to two glasses of wine, which, you know, in the past we've been encouraged because of the, the benefits of red wine that we can get from other places, um, has been kind of a driver. But also I think most people feel like that's the kind of... that's kind of the transition from a full day to a relaxing.

[00:28:56] and I still do that, but with non-alcoholic beverages. So talk about that and, uh, see if we can support some people who are listening who might be struggling with that.

[00:29:06] Donna: Yeah, it's such a, a socially acceptable and even social pressure to drink. I was speaking to someone just this morning, and she was at a lunch yesterday, and she was with three or four women, and they were all drinking quite a lot of wine, and she wasn't drinking. And there was a lot of pressure on her to drink, which I don't think happens so much in the younger generation now.

[00:29:31] I think it actually is probably our generation that are a lot heavier into the alcohol. I always think it-- if someone's drinking excessively and they're pushing other people to, it just makes them feel better if you're being bad too. Like, I feel better about it. It's like groups of smokers.

[00:29:47] Like, if, if one's not smoking, you're sort of the odd one out. So there's a bit of that peer pressure around it. But essentially, look, alcohol is quite toxic. it's toxic to our whole system. It's toxic to our liver. [00:30:00] We tolerate it less well as we get older, and many people will probably find that as they get older, that you actually can't handle it like you may have done in your 20s or 30s, which is true.

[00:30:12] Uh, it absolutely impacts sleep enormously. So while some people think that they get to sleep easier if they've been drinking, you'll wake up at about two or three in the morning and then you can't get back to sleep. it dehydrates you. It messes with your electrolytes. It's a huge impact on your liver.

[00:30:32] Um, your liver has to procet- before it processes anything else, so it can lead to insulin resistance and, weight gain, particularly around your belly. and for any woman who's having trouble sleeping as hormones are changing, it's one of the worst things that you could possibly do. So it just has to be moderation.

[00:30:51] You know, certainly avoid any sugary mixes. Keep in mind that, you know, tonic water has as much sugar in it as Coca-Cola. So, you know, just watch the sugary mixes. If you are going to drink, just try and slow it down. Have a big glass of sparkling water next to your glass. If there's a bottle of wine going around the table and you don't want to deal with the peer pressure, then just sip it slowly, have your water, and they'll only fill up your glass every second or third time they come around, and you'll end up drinking a, a couple of glasses less than you normally would have if you weren't thinking about it.

[00:31:24] So it's about just being sensible with those things. Sometimes I'll get You know, a glass that looks like it could be vodka and soda with lime or something, just to get the pressure off, or I'll just let people pour a glass and I just don't drink it. you know, people often when they're drinking, they don't really notice what you're doing anyway.

[00:31:42] and there's usually a lot less pressure from other people than we tend to put on ourselves. And often it's that we want to drink and we say, "Oh, it's because I have to be social," or, "I have to go to a work lunch," or, "I-- it will look strange if I don't drink." They're all the stories we tell ourselves. But at the end of the day, if [00:32:00] you feel it's not serving you well and it's interfering with your cognitive function and your sleep and your stress levels and your metabolic health, then it's probably time to make a different decision about it

[00:32:14] Kristina: Yeah

[00:32:15] absolutely. it's so interesting because it's been so normalized And I like to talk about it 'cause I don't really care what people think, and I think it's actually good to have that conversation because I think, uh, some people find it inspiring that I don't drink or some people find it triggering and, you know, they want me to be bad with them, uh, depending who, who they are.

[00:32:35] But, um, but I find it so crazy that it's so normalized that we get questioned. It's not like I'm sitting there, "Why are you drinking?" Um, you know, it's... Yeah, it's Yeah, exactly. And then, but then I feel like that's kind of what it should be. It should be the other way around. And it's interesting because my son, uh, Axel, he, he has his own business and he went to Chi- He's 18, so he went to China on his own.

[00:32:58] And when I went to China, I did exactly what he's doing but many years ago. We would go on a trade fair all day, which was hard work, and then we would have a drink. Now he meets entrepreneurs from all over the world because you can, you know, connect with like-minded people thanks to technology, and they meet for a run at 5:00 AM.

[00:33:16] And I lo- I absolutely love that because it's just very different culture, and I think the new generation will definitely... You know, there, there are definitely other challenges for the new generation, but I think alcohol is one that, uh, you know, we see less of, which I think is fantastic.

[00:33:32] Donna: Well, interestingly, I went to an event, not that long ago, a business event, and there was quite a lot of entrepreneurs there, and any-- ranging from in their 20s all the way through to sort of 50s, 60s, and nobody drank. And it was actually at a beautiful restaurant, and there was beautiful wines that were on the table.

[00:33:51] It was all part of the event. And I would say 5% of people were drinking, and I just found it so refreshing [00:34:00] that nobody blinked an eye at not drinking. Nobody said, "Oh, you're not drinking." It was almost the ones who were drinking, it was like, "Oh, you're gonna have a drink. Okay." But it was sort of almost the-- just not the norm.

[00:34:13] And I, I smiled to myself and I thought, "How refreshing is that?"

[00:34:17] Kristina: Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. And yeah, abso- Yeah

[00:34:21] I couldn't, uh, I couldn't agree more. When I turned 50, I... So when I turned 40, I had a big party, and when I turned 50, I was like, I actually want it exactly how I want it. So I, I ha- I invited 50 amazing women, and, um, we had a b- a brunch. So it was breakfast at home, and instead of flowers, I had broccoli and herbs and all the things.

[00:34:42] And, um, and, uh, I did serve champagne for those people who wanted it later, but it was like smoothies and, you know, lots of different things. But it was, um, I was like, "Nah, when I'm turning 50, I'm gonna have it exactly how I want it." and it was so great versus having, you know, a big party that wasn't really aligned.

[00:35:00] And I think as we aging, we are, getting very clear on who we are, which is, um, age comes a little bit with wisdom, hopefully.

[00:35:07] Donna: Yes, hopefully.

[00:35:08] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So let's talk about snacking. This is something that I have certainly, struggled with because what I find when I have a big project, and I'm a big dreamer and a big visionary, so I often take a big bite and chew like hell.

[00:35:24] So sometimes when it feels hard, which it often does when you haven't done something. For anyone who's listening who have dreams and goals, it's, it's easy to procrastinate. And for me, it's like, do I need to eat something? Do I need a snack? Do I need a tea? Do I need a coffee? I'd love for you to talk about why we shouldn't snack.

[00:35:43] You talked, I think you mentioned before five hours, which a lot of people would not do, um, in my experience. And also how do we change it? Because I think it's, um, it's kind of a learned behavior that we probably just need to break the cycle.

[00:35:56] Donna: Yeah. So it's very normal [00:36:00] to be snacking these days. As humans, we've evolved through feast and famine. So essentially we would hunt and gather, and we would find something to eat, and we would eat it, and then it could be a day or two or more before we get something else. This is why we store body fat, because it's our reserve fuel tank for later.

[00:36:18] So if there's a famine, we can start tapping into our stored fat for fuel while we don't have anything to eat. And this is just part of human survival. But now there is no famine, there is only feast. And so, you know, we're, we're not designed to have breakfast, have a snack, have a milky coffee, have a piece of fruit, have another bit of this, and have a few pieces of that.

[00:36:41] This is not how our body's designed to function. And so what happens is we're constantly pushing up our glucose and insulin throughout the day and never allowing our body to get down to baseline where we would need to tap into our reserve tank. So if you imagine you're driving your car around and you keep filling up at the petrol station, and you use a bit of fuel, and then you top it up, and then a little bit of fuel, and then you top it up, and if you top it up too much, it go-- flows into the reserve tank.

[00:37:09] So this is what we're doing all day with the reserve tank being our body fat. So if you wanted to use up the main tank and get into the reserve tank, which is what we need to do when we burn body fat and lose weight, it makes sense that you wouldn't keep stopping at the petrol station, right? And keep topping it up.

[00:37:28] You need to let the tank run down to a point where it's empty enough to start dipping over into the other source of fuel. And so snacking is just constantly filling up at the petrol station. Whereas just having a balanced meal, which only elicits a very low blood glucose and insulin response, doesn't take you so high that it's quite easy within the next five hours to get under the line again and start dipping into that stored fat.

[00:37:54] So it's encouraging that metabolic flexibility. It's allowing us to properly [00:38:00] digest a meal. So when we eat a meal, it's gonna take at least four hours for you to actually get that to a point in your stomach where it's pushed into your small intestines to start absorbing nutrients and doing the job that it's doing.

[00:38:13] If you keep pushing things on top of that, it inter-interrupts the process and even your digestion's not working properly. For people who feel like they can't get through five hours without food, you have insulin resistance, and you need to do this more than anybody else So it's that period of metabolic rest.

[00:38:32] It allows your enzymes to replenish. It helps your microbiome do its job. It just lets your body do the digestion and absorption and assimilation of nutrients as it's designed to. And we don't need to eat all day long. We all have a minimum of 200,000 calories in our reserve tank in the source, in the form of body fat.

[00:38:55] So you're not starving for five hours between breakfast and lunch. You've-- If you ran as hard as you could for an hour, you've burned 1,000 calories and you've got 199,000 left, so you're not starving. It's just that your, your fuel is there. You can't tap into it because you're eating too frequently and you're probably insulin resistant

[00:39:16] Kristina: Love that. So for those people who, um, who are used to that snack, is there any tips that you have to kind of... 'Cause I think sometimes you just need to reset something. So do, do you slowly go down and just have a little bit? Or I mean, it just all makes sense, and it's like, I often eat, and I'm, I'm getting very much conscious of it now, but I often eat without even thinking about it.

[00:39:39] Like, I, and it's healthy things, But I definitely one thing that I'm gonna, I'm gonna take away to really stop. So how do we do that?

[00:39:48] Donna: There's two, two sides to it. One is habit, right? So like you said, if you're-- And, and look, there's probably also the biology of it. So if you're stressed, like you said, if you've got a lot going [00:40:00] on and your mind's busy and, and your cortisol's rising, so high levels of cortisol puts you in that, you're in that fight or flight mode.

[00:40:08] So your body wants to run away from danger. Your body doesn't know the difference between, you know, a deadline for work, or a traffic jam or a tiger's chasing you through the jungle. Your body thinks you're in imminent danger when your cortisol goes up. And so that also pushes up your insulin. It starts pushing glucose out of your liver into your bloodstream, ready for you to run as hard as you can away from danger, but you're sitting in your car or you're sitting at your desk.

[00:40:38] And so what happens is that massive flood of glucose from fight or flight means you get this massive flood of insulin, and insulin's job is to clear glucose from your blood. But it's gonna clear too much because it's been such a big spike, so your glucose will drop too low. Then it's like, "Oh, I-- quick, I need something.

[00:40:56] I need to snack, I need to..." And so it's this cycle, this rollercoaster that you put yourself on throughout the day. So stress can do that to us. Even one bad night of sleep, like I said, can do that to us the next day. So there is a biological side to it. And so understanding that, so that when you start to feel it, you know what's happening.

[00:41:16] You can say, "All right. What I need to do is go out for a walk, do something that brings me joy, listen to some music." Anything that's gonna bring your cortisol down is gonna make that go away. Snacking is gonna make it 20 times worse 'cause it's gonna push it up even higher. and the habit side of things, we tend to associate-- People will say, "Oh, straight after work, I do this."

[00:41:37] It's like people need a, a have a coffee and they need a cigarette. Like we, we always associate habits. So if it is a habit, you need to change that. So if you're used to having something sweet after dinner, now you're gonna have a peppermint tea. Beau- you know, sort of brew a beautiful pot of tea and make it a little ritual that you do after dinner.

[00:41:57] Or get up after dinner and go out for a [00:42:00] walk. remove yourself from the situation, and by the time you get back, you won't even think about it. So there's ways of breaking habits that are not serving you well. Um, but you need to be aware that there's also a biological side to it as well, that once you understand it, then you can reason with it a lot better and make a better choice in the situation.

[00:42:21] Kristina: Yeah. Abso- completely makes sense. Thank you so much for sharing that. I'd love to dip quickly into cortisol, because I think that's, um, something that a lot of people are struggling with, especially if they're in a high-pressure job or are entrepreneurs, and also, the love of coffee.

[00:42:39] Donna: Yeah

[00:42:41] Kristina: So, um, I often l- I often make a joke, um, which I might have to stop doing after this conversation, but, um, I, I also, I have quite a lot of friends in the wellness industry and, uh, I'm super aware of a lot of things.

[00:42:55] But coffee is one thing that I absolutely love, and I g- I get so much pleasure from it, so I'm not, I don't wanna take it away, but I, I know that there are some changes that I could do in terms of having it after breakfast, et cetera. But I wanna talk about what's your opinion about coffee when it comes to cortisol?

[00:43:14] Because what I do is, like, have for a very, very long time, I always start with two big glasses of water with a little bit of a pinch of, salt and lemon. It's just, it's wherever I am, it doesn't matter if I'm in a hotel, I always, the first thing I go when I go somewhere is, like, buying lemons 'cause that's just, it's just part of it.

[00:43:32] But then I do love a good coffee. So I'd love for you to talk about coffee, how we can manage that and still enjoy it.

[00:43:38] Donna: Yeah. Look, I'm a huge coffee lover as well. So, it's ideally you want to have no more than two single shot, caffeine doses. So that tea, coffee, whatever it might-- Keep in mind things like green tea also have caffeine in them. People often don't realise. also if you have a barista coffee, if you ask for a long black, there's sometimes four shots in it.

[00:43:59] So [00:44:00] people need to be aware of what they're drinking. If you exceed that amount... A-and also before midday, you wanna think about your, your bedtime and reverse engineer that ten hours back, and that's your last coffee. 'Cause it takes ten hours for caffeine to process out of your system. Some people take a bit longer.

[00:44:18] So you want to know that it will interrupt your sleep. If people think it doesn't, it'll interrupt the quality of your sleep. As you said, with your Oura Ring, you will see that straight away. So maximum of two single shots of, of coffee a day before midday. ideally not the very first thing that you have.

[00:44:37] Like you said, if you have some water or something first, it's better. cort- our cortisol levels will rise if you exceed that threshold. So if you have more caffeine, you will have a direct cortisol response to that caffeine, which is gonna push up your insulin straight away and start that whole rollercoaster that I spoke about earlier.

[00:44:54] So it's just moderation with it and knowing what you're drinking and when. Our cortisol levels start off at their highest point. That's what wakes us up in the morning. So you'll have a, a sharp spike in cortisol first thing in the morning, which is normal, and then it will slowly taper off through the day, and then you want it to be its lowest point for you to go to sleep in the evening.

[00:45:13] And that's a normal cortisol curve that happens throughout the day. Some people that are not in sync with their body clock will end up with their cortisol low in the morning, and it rises throughout the day, and it's too high at night, and they can't go to sleep. So getting into sync with your body clock, doing all the things we spoke about earlier, will really impact that as well

[00:45:33] Kristina: Yeah, makes complete sense. Thank you so much for that. So, um, this has been so inspiring. I feel like we haven't even digged into so many things in the book. It's just, there's just so many things that I'm gonna encourage everyone to buy a copy and read it. But I wanted to ask you a couple of, um, other questions now, and that is about your morning ritual.

[00:45:54] So I am a big, morning person. I, I feel like, like that's the best part of [00:46:00] my day. I, now when my children are, you know, growing up, they st- they still live at home, but I, I'm not as needed anymore. Like, my morning is, like, the best part of my day. So I am curious, have you got a morning ritual, and if yes, would you be happy to share it?

[00:46:15] Donna: It's very simple. I, I still work a lot of hours, but the thing that I will not compromise on in the morning, I'm up early, I'm always up early, is I walk my dog. Uh, 'cause I want to get sunlight in my eyes, so I wanna get some daylight. It's one of the best things that you can do first thing in the morning if the sun is up at that time.

[00:46:32] I like to go out for a walk with my dog. It helps me to sort of, I guess, settle my mind into what I'm doing for the day. I enjoy the fresh air. I'm inside most of the day. My dog loves it. Um, so my morning ritual is pretty much that, and then getting myself ready for work and coming in and knowing that I've already done that.

[00:46:51] And if I get another walk later, it's a great bonus. Um, but at least I've done that one. So that's-- And I'll have my coffee and things once I get to work

[00:47:00] Kristina: Yeah. Yeah, fantastic. And, um, in terms of strength training, we haven't got into that, but I know how important that is. And, uh, that's, you know, I... Because I think my lifestyle has been really hectic and lots of travelling, it's, for me, I, like yoga and walking has been like kind of my, my go-to exercise for many years, and I've been lucky to, you know, having a healthy weight and all that stuff.

[00:47:22] But very aware that, and I have started, but I don't feel like I am, I'm at my peak yet when it comes to strength training. So any tips on, for people who, who are like me, who are lou- like feel like they're just, it's just such a h- full days where that strength training just feels like another thing, versus yoga feels like, even though sometimes that can be hard as well, it's kind of, you know, you always finish on a very low, beautiful way.

[00:47:49] So have you got some tips on that? And also, I li- I don't love gyms. Um, I don't love the, the lights and the music and, um, [00:48:00] sometimes always don't wanna be around people either when you have space for

[00:48:03] Donna: Yeah. Look, women, women typically walk into a gym and gravitate to the cardio equipment or a class, and the gym floor is empty. And they're not going to-- 'cause it's intimidating and they don't know how to use it, and it's all too hard. And it's really important that we feel comfortable in a gym, I think, as well.

[00:48:20] So I would suggest anyone who can to get a trainer, if you're going to do that, at least for a period of time or to give you a program or something, even if it's a one-off, just to teach you how to use the equipment. I find the gym for me is my meditation. So I have my AirPods in. I'm listening to s- either a podcast or I'm listening to music, and I love it because it's just my-- it's for me.

[00:48:45] It's me time. And so I love it. I love really focusing on my muscles. I talk about it in the book where if anyone tells me they don't like strength training, they generally haven't understood strength training yet. And so to get a connection between your mind and the muscle and really be able to work it to its optimum, and it takes a lot of concentration to do it properly.

[00:49:08] And while I'm thinking about that, I can't think about anything else, which is why I say it's like my meditation. So I think it's really important that we, we lift heavy things, and we do it with really good technique. And if we don't know-- If we didn't know how to play tennis, we'd get a tennis coach. If we didn't know how to play golf, we'd get a golf coach.

[00:49:27] So if you don't know how to train in a gym, you need someone to help you. Most gyms will have that service available. And the other option is on Aston RX, on our, online platform. We also have like a strength assessment that we go through, and then we give you the appropriate level of exercise, and you can do it at home.

[00:49:46] And that's even a good start for some people. If they don't know where to start, then doing it at home like that is a good start until you feel confident enough in the technique that you've learnt that now I feel like I could walk into a gym, and I would feel [00:50:00] comfortable doing something in the gym

[00:50:01] Kristina: Yeah, yeah. Fantastic advice. Thank you So much. another question is, has there been a book that had a big impact on you? So maybe a nonfiction book in terms of a book that changed the way you think or how you live your life or, or had a very, big impact in, in any other shape or form

[00:50:21] Donna: So many books. I've read so many books. Um, a couple that come to mind. I love "Atomic Habits." I don't know if you've read it, but I think, I think it's really clever. Uh, I think he articulates everything really well, and I think it relates a lot to what I do. so for that reason, I love it. there was a book back in the '70s called "Erroneous Zones" by Wayne Dyer, and he was a psychologist.

[00:50:46] and it was a very clever book. It's also available still on audio, if you can find it, and he has one of those voices that's quite nice to listen to on audio. And it will make you smile because he'll talk about stories about, you know-- It's about erroneous, behavior, so things that we repeat that don't serve us well.

[00:51:08] And he gives us different analogies and different case studies about it, which will make you smile 'cause it will remind you of something you've done or something someone else does repetitively, and he explains why. And I just-- I found his insights really, really insightful. I really loved it.

[00:51:24] Kristina: Yeah. Fantastic. Thank you. I haven't read that one. I've definitely read Atomic Habits, so, um, um, I'm gonna get that on my next walk, so thank you very much for sharing. This is one of the favorite parts of people because I run a couple of book clubs as well. People always love book tips, so thank you very much for that.

[00:51:40] The last question I have for you is knowing what you know now, what kind of advice would you give your younger self? So maybe when you were kind of starting this journey, I'm sure there will be some great advice.

[00:51:56] Donna: Just, just believe in yourself. Um, just, just trust, [00:52:00] trust your gut and believe in yourself, and just, just do it. I've, I've always thrown myself into things, and I always, you know, bite off too much and chew like hell. That's sort of always been my philosophy. And I'll never say no to anything. I'll give anything a try.

[00:52:16] I'll never say, "Oh, I can't do that," or, "I haven't done it." So I've always given it a try, but I haven't always believed in myself when I've done it. And I think as I get older, I realise that, hey, I, I actually can trust in myself and believe in myself, and I wish I had done that a lot more in the earlier days.

[00:52:33] It probably

[00:52:33] Kristina: Yeah.

[00:52:33] Donna: made life a, a lot easier

[00:52:35] Kristina: Yeah, I think also with experience comes that belief, so, um, I feel like now I-- there's not one thing that I don't think I can do, which is a really great feeling. But I think sometimes we need the experience to kind of know that.

[00:52:47] But, um, because I don't think you can put a really old head on a young, young body, because I think sometimes you need to make the mistakes and it-- which is the hardest part as being a parent, I think.

[00:52:58] Donna: Yeah,

[00:52:59] Kristina: But Yeah, Yeah. Well, this has been so inspiring. I'm gonna link your book, I'm gonna link your program for anyone who wants, uh, and needs it, and I am super excited about having a, a more in-depth, catch-up with you inside the Dream Life Coaching Program.

[00:53:14] So Thank you. so much for coming here today and for doing our extra session, but also for everything that you do that makes complete sense and, uh, will make, no doubt, the world a better place. So Thank you so much

[00:53:27] Donna: Thank you. Thank you so much for having me

[00:53:29] Kristina: Thank you.

[00:53:31] Wow, that was so inspiring. I am super excited to implement so much of what I learned today in this conversation, and I hope you are too. And if you wanna go another step, we are having a workshop with Donna inside the Dream Life Coaching program. So if you're in my program or want to join, yourdreamlifestartshere.com.

[00:53:55] And in August, we're gonna focus on health and wellbeing and [00:54:00] energy because there is no point having a beautiful dream life if you don't have health and if you don't have energy to make it all happen. So I'm super excited about August. I hope you are too. And, uh, make sure you get a copy of Donna's book.

[00:54:15] I'll link to that as well. Have a beautiful weekend if you're listening to this on a Friday, and I look forward to s- have you back here on Monday for our next Monday Morning Motivation episode. I'll see you then

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